Difference between Legacy and Fast Track Fluency

I was doing Fast Track Fluency. I went on vacation and when I came back, Fast Track Fluency had been divided into 10 levels and all my progress statistics had zeroed out. Then at the bottom of the page was Legacy Fluency, with my progress statistics.

Is there any advantage to switching to Fast Track Fluency over Legacy Fluency? If I switch to Fast Track Fluency will I be repeating words I’ve already studied?

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I found the same a few weeks ago. Personally I find legacy far superior, as the tiered version starts with way too simple words: pronoun after pronoun, article after article.

It doesn’t seem to wipe progress or add words to legacy progress.

I simply ignore the tiered version, and am working on “legacy”

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I can see one advantage to new FFT, that you can jump in at any level.

However, the new FFT doesn’t seem well integrated (yet?), as the global search doesn’t find any of its sentences, as far as I can tell.

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They sent an email a few weeks ago explaining it. I searched for a blog post about it but didn’t find one.

My impression is that a vocal minority of people didn’t like the organization of fast track. The developer previously implemented different progress displays but I guess this wasn’t enough.

In my professional life and in forums for games I play, I see this cycle over and over: users questioning the validity of design choices until inevitably the developers feel pressure to respond by modifying something perfectly good, bifurcating or regressing it. Then usually the silent majority of people who were using it happily are confounded as to why it was changed. The virtues of a design aren’t always obvious until you see the alternative. Maybe I’m wrong about this case, but in general I wish developers felt more comfortable saying “no” and sticking with their design choices if they were justified. Design by focus group doesn’t always succeed.

As far as I can tell, the new version brings redundant features from the other cloze collections into the fast track, which dilutes its purpose (users could always have supplemented the fast track with other cloze collections). :person_shrugging:

P.S. this is a general discussion topic and not language specific.

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I tend to keep to Legacy and always believe in “if it ain’t broke…”.

Incidentally “bifurcating” is a fine word. I must check it out.

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Nevertheless, as long as the “legacy” FFT is still available, I’m thankful for a lot of new sentences, hopefully with fewer quality problems than those sourced from Tatoeba.

@mike: Global Search doesn’t work on the new FFT sentences (tested in both Spanish and Italian from English). Surely that’s an oversight?

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bifurcating is a good word. :slight_smile:

Sorry I missed your initial post @Macossay. We’d sent an email like @seveer mentioned, but we need to do better explaining it in the UI (and probably write a blog post too).

The advantages of the new Fast Track are

  1. It’s split out into 10 collections of 1,000 sentences each so that
    a. You can jump to the level that suits your current level best and
    b. It’s easier to see progress (playing 20 sentences out of 20,000 = 0.1%, not very visible or motivating, vs 20 out of 1,000 = 2% = progress!).
  2. It’s almost entirely new different content (a small subset of sentences are coincidentally the same in the two).
  3. It’s fully human translated and curated. That doesn’t mean there won’t still be the occasional issue, but the existing Fast Tracks uses crowd-sourced content that’s machine curated and human moderated. By machine curated I mean that we used code to decide which sentences go in the collection, and human moderated I mean that our team of language consultants have moderated a subset of the sentences and respond to sentence issues reported by users, but there’s still a subset of content that hasn’t been moderated by our team just due to large number of sentences (the Italian Fast Track alone has 18,000+ sentences, the rough equivalent of 3 decent sized novels). The quality of the Fast Track also varies by language.

Thanks to revenue from Clozemaster Pro, we’ve been able to develop a set 10,000 sentences that we’re now working to have translated across languages for the new Fast Track. It’s essentially a new set of collections that’s easier to play through at your level and see progress, and with content that we’re much more confident in.

The advantages to switching are those mentioned above, for example if you find the now Legacy Fast Track to be not a good fit for your current level, or if seeing progress is a slog. Otherwise we definitely plan on keeping the Legacy Fast Track, I really like it, and aside from the name and placement there are no other changes planned.

The Legacy Fast Track for many languages is on the order of 18,000+ sentences. It’s an awesome challenge and I love it, but it has notable downsides not really resolved with different progress displays like I mentioned above:

  • Seeing your progress is painfully slow.
  • If you have some experience with the language, the start can be a slog and you can end up piling up a bunch of reviews for relatively basic vocab/sentences.
  • Quality varies by language.
  • It’s a challenge to moderate that much content for many languages.

The approach for the Legacy Fast Track is also a challenge for less popular languages that don’t currently have a lot of content. They either have a much smaller Fast Track, or we’d otherwise need to translate content into those languages at some point and it becomes a question of what content should we translate.

The idea for the new Fast Track is to have a set of collections with high quality content, that’s easier to see your progress as you play through, that allow you to better play at your level, and that’s played roughly in order of difficulty like the Legacy Fast Track.

So the idea was to create a set of 10,000 sentences that we could have translated for any language and that could be played through in collections of 1,000 sentences each to address the issues above. It’s largely new content and a new feature to some extent (perhaps it was a mistake to rename the Fast Track to Legacy and call this new set of collection the Fast Track instead, naming things is difficult).

I’m super excited about it - not only does it hopefully address the issues above, but we now have a plan and system in place to continue expanding it for every language.

Up to now we didn’t have a good solution for “Welsh only has 900 sentences” - now it has the new 10,000 sentence Fast Track. And we can do the same for Korean, Cantonese, Persian, etc. And what’s more (!) if we have the same set of sentences translated from English into Welsh, and from English into Spanish, we should, likely with just some minor modifications, be able to offer Spanish for Welsh speakers and Welsh for Spanish speakers, etc.

Agreed the design and naming could be probably be improved. We’re working to update the web app dashboard so that only the collections you’re playing show up on the dashboard and all collections are listed in a separate tab, so hopefully that should make the Legacy Fast Track placement largely a non-issue. As far as naming, we’re open to ideas.

Curious to hear if anyone has any further thoughts or feedback given the information above.

Correct. I don’t have a specific timeline at the moment, but we do plan to get them added to the global search.

Thanks for all the feedback, more is always welcome!

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You are completely right, Mr. Seveer.
On the other hand, I myself am a huge fan of improvement, even if some “cozy” traits are left behind.
I am planning my transfering as soon as the Listening > Transcribe option is available!

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The detailed reply from “Mike” is what makes Clozemaster so special! On another unnamed site, I once had to create several aliases in order to contact the “boss”, and I wrote twice to their HO. A reply? You must be joking. What a different story here, we really are most fortunate.

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Thanks @mike ! I see there is a lot more to it than I realized. Bringing a huge collection to languages that currently have little content was not an aspect I’d considered, and that alone is worth the effort. Appreciate your work as always.

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This is the big one. They really need Listening > Transcribe support before I can move over too.

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I’m a little confused: Shouldn’t “Fluency Fast Track” be renamed to “Legacy Fast Track” in Reviews as well? Pretty sure I haven’t played thousands of sentences in the new fast track already. :melting_face:
ft

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So, we are lucky, my friend, it is already implemented - at least in Spanish. :grin:

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Thanks Mike. I don’t recall seeing the email – probably a spam filter deleted it. I started over using the new Fluency Fast track and I do prefer it. I’m satisfied with the amount of new content and I think the human validated sentences are an improvement.

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@mike: I’ve found at least one sentence in the new Spanish from English FFT that is sourced from Tatoeba, but there is no attribution or link to that sentence on Tatoeba.

“Tom gana mucho dinero traduciendo menús para restaurantes.” (Level 10)

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Work in progress! Thanks for letting us know.

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Spanish for Welsh speakers would be really cool. Bring it on. And vice versa would be popular with Spanish speakers of Welsh heritage in Argentina.

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Let me add a word of appreciation for the imaginative pictures that now are available after answering on the Spanish from English new FFT. I didn’t think I was going to like them, but I’m already finding that they help me recall not only the cloze word but the entire sentence. A great addition!

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i think the new legacy fast track is a good idea, but i don’t like the way it was implemented. this site’s design seems stuck in the idea that we should learn words in order of frequency. but there’s no basis for believing that makes sense. as someone mentioned above, you get a ton of grammar words first, which largely have no clear meaning to beginners. like should beginners learning spanish really learn ‘se’ before ‘persona’, or ‘entonces’ before ‘agua’? that isn’t how babies learned their first language, and that isn’t how adults learn secondary languages.

so i’d suggest that the best way to do a fluency fast track would be to put the most important words first, not the most frequently used. they aren’t quite the same thing. one way to do that would be to bias the early parts of fluency fast track towards nouns and verbs, not towards parts of speech.

like think of a baby’s first word. it’s often mama, dada, baba (for bottle), or something like that. a baby’s first word in english is never “the” or “a” or “an” or “in” or any of those other grammatical parts of speech which are the most common words. they learn nouns first, and then verbs, and the parts of speech they learn much later, even though they are the most common words. because you can form rudimentary sentences if you know the noun and the verb. but knowing a bunch of grammatical words, but no nouns or verbs, will get you nowhere in communication.

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Hi, rinkuhero!

I think the idea of the old “Legacy Fast Track” (as opposed to the new tiered Fast Track is that it is based on most commonly used words, statistically speaking. I do wonder how this was decided though, as it has a tendency to plow through words (including all their variants) like “uccidere” (to kill); or “andarsene” (go away), “testimone” (witness) - in addition to mama, papa, etc. I suspect it (Tatoeba?) pulls from newspapers perhaps. It’s an odd grouping of common words.

The new tiered Fast Track is hand-curated, and so clearer in words being fundamental perhaps

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